Keith, 01 Mar 2010@5800 User
I don't think the comparison to Linux is apt. Mobile phone OS always come in a ... moreI agree with you, i'm a Nokia fan but now am going to get the Blackberry (For Business/BB ping)
and i-phone (all in one internet, music and GAMES).
The iphone are killing it with the apps right now, people want an all in one phone, Nokia lost it's way but there's still hope.Nokia N958gb is the best Nokia phone to me as it had it right with the Ngage games which some looked like PSOne games, Ngage community similar to Xbox live, it's was an all in one but the main features i look for is the games and all the game dev moved from Nokia to i-phone, but each has there prefrence, some are interested in Gps and maps, others a24Megapixel camera (Joking) but you get my drift. N96 and N97 are just update from the N95 and wasn't innovating just recycling, that why i think they lost there way no different OS till Maemo came out. In the If the games the are on the i-phone are also on Android handset and not the puzzle games then it might sway me, till then
Anonymous, 02 Mar 2010i just hope s4 has capacitive screen and threaded sms these are importants4 or S60v4 it's software, not hardware!
i just hope s4 has capacitive screen and threaded sms
these are important
nokia still sell thier s4 phone very well despite no innovation found in this concept video(more ui festures to come in the final version)
do you really think new android and new iphone os has new features?
Wow you all can judged symbian is bad, not good, poor before they release. Amazing.......
Just wait n see..... ;-)
Nokia is dying slowly but surely.Yes i am a Nokia user..E71 and 5800xm and i think it is sad tha Nokia lost its creativity.
Anonymous, 01 Mar 2010I think is Apple's strategy to limit the availability to certain carriers...
For example, w... moreThe case in Hong Kong is just like Canada. Over here, we have all 3 major telcos selling the iPhone. As a result the iPhone is really, really becoming popular. And it's become the new upgrade path for anybody that had a dumbphone before. And that's exactly what the iPhone is: a consumer smartphone, or a smartphone for dumbphone users. And that's why it sells so well. People on here can laugh about iPhone users all they want. At the end of the day, that's a sale for Apple and a loss for Nokia. And that's the only thing that matters. If Nokia keeps pushing things like Maemo, which is difficult to use for your average user, then Apple, Android and Windows Phone 7 will keep eating its market-share.
And what people really forget and ignore about the iPhone is its sales inertia. Once you get an iPhone and load it up with apps, particularly if you've paid for them, when it comes time to upgrade you're going to want another iPhone because you're going to want to be able to transfer all your apps. And beyond that, a lot of apps are designed so that you can share and interact with other users. So if your friends have iPhones than you'll probably want one too just so you can join the party with whatever popular app they're in to.
This is why apps and native app stores are very important in determining what OS a person will use and if they stick around with the same OS. You can pretty much judge the future of any OS by looking at their app store for both quality and quantity.
The future beyond that, I'd argue is cloud computing services and your handset as a cloud portal. Here Android's got the lead. Windows Phone 7 is a close second. The iPhone is running third with mobileme. And Nokia is probably on the same level as Apple with Ovi.
5800 user, 01 Mar 2010Remember Windows/Linux/MAC scenario in desktops and how Linus benefitted from all the various ... more@5800 User
I don't think the comparison to Linux is apt. Mobile phone OS always come in a variety of flavours. That's as true for Symbian as it is for Android. Obviously Sony Ericsson's implementation of Symbian is not going to be the same as what Nokia pulls off for it's own handsets. The same is true for Android.
You're suggesting that Nokia is not going to sit around. Well maybe they won't. But why are they already behind on the interface in comparison to say Android (I won't say iPhone cause the interfaces are basically very similar....and how long to put in kinetic scrolling?). And more importantly than the interface (which every Nokia fan on here seems to ignore), why are they so far behind on apps and web services integration?
You suggest that Maemo is their high-end platform. If that's true, Nokia's got a problem. Why give away their high-end platform? It's going to take a while to finish the merger with Moblin. In the meantime the competition is pulling ahead. And the other issue, is if this their high-end platform, what are they going to put on all their other phones? Android spans the spectrum. Windows Phone 7 will too. iPhones are getting cheaper every year and they won't be a premium product for much longer. Yet, Nokia has only one platform that they are selling with Maemo right now? And this is supposed to be the future? This is supposed the platform that gets the masses to part with their cash?
And again all this debate on the UI, ignores the point. The reason the iPhone is popular is because of the apps. It's not because of the UI (though that helps). The reason Android is popular is because of integration with Google's services and now it's got more and more apps. A mobile OS has to do far more than look pretty these days. Users have moved beyond that. They'll want a decent selection of apps and full OS integration with web based services. The Ovi Store is woefully behind on both the number and quality of the apps. And that's not even take into account the store implementation. It's the worst designed app store of any OS.
You're right that users who've used Symbian ('old people' as you term them) will keep using Symbian. Most of them don't care for smartphones. Currently Symbian's close enough in implementation to a dumbphone grid based menu to keep them happy. And they'll keep buying Nokias. But that market will get smaller and smaller every year. Younger users will want what I've pointed out above. Older power users will probably migrate to Windows Phone 7 or to a Blackberry. That's why I am predicting a continued drop in market-share. That's not to say that Nokia won't remain king of the dumbphone market for a long time to come. But it's dominance on smartphones is very much under threat these days. Largely because Nokia's rested on its laurels....and why not? Look at some of the posters here. They are as rabid Symbian fans as iPhone users are Apple fanatics. When you've got people that buy without thinking, why innovate?
And if they keep costing for 5 years like you suggest, they'll really be in trouble. We're moving to a web based future where cloud computing is a big deal. In that kind of world, the Google or Microsoft brand is worth far more than the brand of a hardware manufacturer like Nokia. Either they'll really have to innovate with Symbian or they can choose to watch their smartphone market-share keep rolling down the slope. Or they can swallow their pride and start putting out Android and Windows Phone 7 handsets like every other OEM.
And remember at at the end of the day it's not necessarily how good your platform is that matters. It's how well it sells. Having a great platform is only important in so far as it helps you sell your phones. Nokia could make the best OS. And if nobody buys it, that'll be the end of Nokia. If they have the prettiest UI, but there's very few apps, there's no integration with web based services (other than Ovi maps), nobody's going to be running to a store for a Symbian handset when there are alternatives that do all that and have a pretty UI.
Now, we can ask
why pay more to get iphones
we nokia users can get multitouch on feature-rich nokia touch phones for a much cheaper price than ifruit? Free navigation and many essential apps
We may get the answers like this
we feel more cool with iphone in our hands
we are the fashion leader
i not jugde s4 now ,it is too early to judge,
would like to see a noce music player ui
home screen like maemo
ovi map just great
It is the way symbian goes to perfection!
The ui is fixed, what would you ask for more?
Look forward to nokia flagship 2010
Keith, 01 Mar 2010I am not slamming Symbian because I dislike it (I've enjoyed my 5800 since it came out). I am... moreI think is Apple's strategy to limit the availability to certain carriers...
For example, where I live we've 5 carriers (but HK is only about the size of the whole Bay Area, if not less). Initially iphone was sold either through "1" carrier with contract (also unlock), or one can pay the "full price" for an unlock one, and the carrier had been enjoying monopoly since summer 2008.
Just this Jan iphone is available thru a 2nd carrier, and the compeition among the carriers only brought in more new users of iphones for each carrier. A third company is already offering iphone "plans" which I suspect it will also carry iphone, perhaps 4G....
So growth will continue for Apple for sure.
PS. I'm using Android based Milestone and I hate Symbian for the rest of my life.
Keith, 01 Mar 2010Would Nokia make an Android phone though? They seem pretty committed to Symbian even while oth... moreRemember Windows/Linux/MAC scenario in desktops and how Linus benefitted from all the various flavors and then died because it was basically competeing against itself? the scene wont be that bad with Android but remember Symbian(nokia) is not gonna twiddle thumbs when others are getting upgrades. Currently it is cashing in as much on an old horse as it possibly can but certainly they should have a few tricks up their sleeve, and look how they got Maemo out of nowhere? thats their advanced OS and it is certainly as good (if not better) than Android, and of course, old people are still gonna use Symbian for another 5 years so.. pretty much Nokia is in shape for next 5 years unless it does something very very stupid.
Keith, 01 Mar 2010I am not slamming Symbian because I dislike it (I've enjoyed my 5800 since it came out). I am... moreOh shut up dude..jaz sold ur 5800 and get n1..end of story.u dnt ned to bash symbian.dnt worry.if symbian^2,3&4 fails.there is maemo 5,6,7,and so forth.
Anonymous, 01 Mar 2010@5800 User Any Android phone....You are right technically, but referance to context, i mean phones back when no android was dreamed of... i am as big an android phone as you are mate
5800 user, 01 Mar 2010And we come to Android. Its good. very good and very customisable and user friendly. Google ju... moreWould Nokia make an Android phone though? They seem pretty committed to Symbian even while others (like SE) seem to have no problem putting their toe in the Android pond. Nokia didn't even flirt with WinMo all this while. Why would they have a change of heart with Android? If they are gonna stick with Symbian they've got their work cut out for them.....I expect that the others will focus less on Symbian too. I don't see an increase in Symbian sales from other OEMs any time soon. They're all busy with Android.
I am not slamming Symbian because I dislike it (I've enjoyed my 5800 since it came out). I am slamming it because it really is falling behind new comers like Android and WinPho 7. Just watch the market share in 2010.
The iPhone has reached pretty much every market it can. But its carrier exclusivity in most countries limits marketshare growth. They'll top out at 25% most likely. Android is going to really grow in 2010. Europe and Asia are finally going to the Android exposure that the US has seen. And Windows Phone 7 will kick in at the end of 2010. Unless Nokia and the Symbian foundation do something absolutely spectacular we should see Symbian's marketshare drop to low 40s (in percentage) or even dip into the high 30s.
Like I've pointed out earlier, it's not necessarily about the interface. It's about the ecosystem. Apple got this right. Symbian used to have this right (one of the first OS to facilitate apps). But it's now Android that's carrying the flag. It's only been around for 2 years, and they've already got 3 times more apps in Android market than the Ovi store, 57% of which are free:
It's also the integration with Google's services. GMail, Google Maps, Google Earth, Google Voice, Latitude, etc. It's all that. Windows Phone 7 is also trying to develop an ecosystem after years of being behind, with xbox Live integration, Bing search, etc. Yet, it seems Symbian has largely focused on bettering the UI with very little emphasis on developing the ecosystem or integrating with an existing ecosystem (say Google's services). It's going to take more than the UI to keep its marketshare.