Anonymous, 29 Mar 2020I'm not sure if people (at least like, 3 people) ever read your lectures ;)Ironically I missed your answer because it was too small xD
Yeah, I know, I often write wall of text so long that Trump would be proud of...
I know that only few read them, but I think this is still worth it.
Emeline Shaw, 29 Mar 2020Thank you for the detailed post. I see what you are talking about and I'm sorry for not taking... moreYour welcome, but hey, you are free to say you don't like something, I just said that we shouldn't bash things without negative impact or that we aren't forced to deal with and those who are already rare enough.
Most peoples don't realize, but their comment can range from no impact to totally changing the whole industry in some rare occurrences, that's why I defend the features I want and fight against too common trend who can negatively impact someone while still defending features I don't personally like (like side or back fingerprint scanner for example), because I think everyone deserve a chance to get his perfect mobile, that's what I fight for, and even if it can see trivial, I think this is a good enough cause to worth my time and efforts.
Demongornot, 29 Mar 2020Well technically freedom of speech is only about you having the freedom to criticize the gover... moreThank you for the detailed post. I see what you are talking about and I'm sorry for not taking it serious. You are right that Freedom of Speech doesn't allow us to say anything we want because it's still regulated in the law.
Demongornot, 29 Mar 2020Well technically freedom of speech is only about you having the freedom to criticize the gover... moreI'm not sure if people (at least like, 3 people) ever read your lectures ;)
Emeline Shaw, 29 Mar 2020We have Freedom of speech so we can do whatever we want;)
Well technically freedom of speech is only about you having the freedom to criticize the government without them having the right to stop you doing that, though Julian Assange would probably tell you some interesting things about said freedom of speech.
But it does not mean peoples should be rude or peoples have the right to say certain things like verbal agression, ethnic related horrible things and such which are still punishable by law.
But here, yes, you clearly have the right to criticize smartphones the way you want.
Though there is one rule I would really appreciate if peoples could respect :
Other than the obvious "no brand bashing" which is not allowed by GSMArena's rules, it is complaining about rare features, I mean, you could complain all day long about common, trending or invasive level of appearance features like punch hole, notch, curved edge display or even too many camera on budget phones which increase their cost or 5G (which is too early to be adopted by that many phones but still become mandatory) etc...
But once the feature doesn't do anything negative for those who don't want it (including not inflating too much the price) or more importantly, is rare, or at the bring of disappearing, this is really a toxic behavior to complain that through all the 95%+ available smartphone, a feature that may be on a single one and with a lot of peoples liking it is implemented...
For features that could be on most phones without issues :
Audio Jack doesn't cause negative things to the user even if he don't want one, same for wireless charging which is cheap and take close to no space, Always On Display which can be disabled, dual sim + SD which also isn't a cost or space concern, IP rating (though it certainly shouldn't be an excuse to remove other features), NFC, notification led, etc etc.
For features that should be implemented on a certain number of phones (enough to have diversity and being able to get the combinaison we want) but not all :
pop up camera even though I REALLY like them I still understand that not everyone want one but since it is a rare occurrence peoples shouldn't complain about it as it, same with additional sensors like DoF and ToF, any fingerprint scanner (underdisplay being optical, IR or ultrasonic, lateral, on button below the display or on the back), 3D facial recognition, dual display phones, foldable phones (I'd hate if they become THE main trend, but it would be nice of there is still enough of them for everyone to choose what they like), xenon flash, other SoC than Qualcomm, removable battery, Android One...
So basically in an ideal world, we should really only criticize stuff like build quality, bad OS, too common features which add relatively more to the price or at user's invasive for those who don't want them and are on too many phones (more than half or a quarter ?) of those being released...
Siao Lang, 27 Mar 2020Ewwww that hole punch on the screen. FuglyYes it's so useless and ugly and they also curved the screen again those noobs
Anonymous, 27 Mar 2020It's not the physical appearance. You can't reach the best results if your sensors are generic... moreYeah they fell into corporate greed just like Xiaomi and Oppo..
Oneplus 8 Pro is just another sh*tty midrange phone with ugly back, generic design, useless feature and a sky high price tag..
Price will start at 1200 dollars.
HYPR, 27 Mar 2020Good. Don't buy it then. We don't care. How about comment on a phone you'd love to own. This p... moreDude, the cameras are gonna be just as bad as on the last models. Big improvements..
Better to just buy a real phone.
Dometalican, 26 Mar 2020So....no headphone jack again....I can see the OBVIOUS spot that could fit it but nooooooooooo... moreI would have to agree with you but sadly no phone OEM implements it anymore in their flagships.
Okay I know LG still does, but who even buys their DOA's.
flagshipper, 27 Mar 2020popup camera was a great solution to the AIDS of the mobile era: notches and punchholes. i'd g... moreSeriously heavy? What are you a munchkin? I love the proper feel of weight I get from my 1+7T Pro.
flagshipper, 27 Mar 2020popup camera was a great solution to the AIDS of the mobile era: notches and punchholes. i'd g... morePartially true, it is a solution who work, and work well but who also have a lot of room for improvement.
Underdisplay camera are far from the perfect solution as most think, they have tons of issues, most which won't be resolved, only reduced.
The BEST solution is actually the simplest :
No front camera, whatever it is through a second display on the back, or a futuristic direct eye projection tech on the back or simply just no front cam on a regular phone, it is THE best solution for having fullscreen and privacy.
popup camera was a great solution to the AIDS of the mobile era: notches and punchholes. i'd get 7TPro if it wasn't heavy.
i wish there were more popup cams at the moment.
but... it's a temporary solution, we need camera under display.
or under a bezel, like Xperia 1ii does. I love bezels, and hate random touches on nowadays phones. i wonder, do people really want those extreme screentobody ratios? Why this mania exists?
Whackcar, 27 Mar 2020TL;DR
I'll just say this. If Pop-Up was a good solution, it would've gotten adopted by ever... moreExcept that in my long text I explained with FACTS and real life exemples.
While you are simply stating theoretical stuff.
You want to know why it haven't been adopted by everyone ?
Exactly because of what you and peoples like you do, stating TOTALLY WRONG stuff about pop up, which scared off MANY peoples, the pop up had a LOT of popularity at first, then the more afraid persons stated false claims about it, the more got scared away, which lowered its popularity, making it useless to evolve, meaning it simply now have too low potential buyers to actually be worth taking risk of making it on most phones, as if it is not popular enough, company loose money.
The more practical IS actually bezel, I explained why punch hole and notch are stupid and negative.
The fact is, the more peoples say wrong shits about the pop up, the more it decrease in popularity, and it is ALREADY RARE ENOUGH, so, no, if I one day want to get the smartphone with the features I wish, I need to fight totally wrongs arguments from peoples like you to explain what it really is : The pop up DOES NOT have any reliability, wear out or fragility issues, of all the solutions of front camera, it is the best if we weight pros and cons.
It is THE only good tech who allow for privacy which you SHOULD care about :
And it is already rare enough, for peoples who don't like it, there is TONS of alternative, over 95% of the phones on the market come without pop up, if you want a phone without pop up, you SIMPLY have to choose one of those thousands available, for us who want pop up for fullscreen, privacy or both, we NEED TO FIGHT in order to not lets the pop up disappear because of peoples constantly saying stupid, false, unproved things that goes against evidences, proof, tests, demonstrations, polls, logic, equivalents mechanism/tech and facts.
Demongornot, 27 Mar 2020Well, sorry to break that to you but the MAJORITY of customers don't care, and for those who c... moreTL;DR
I'll just say this. If Pop-Up was a good solution, it would've gotten adopted by everyone else. Yet it didn't.
Notch & Punch-Hole are more practical, hence every manufacturer is switching to those.
That Fact isn't gonna change no matter how long paragraphs you write about it. So just calm down & settle with it.
Whackcar, 27 Mar 2020To the people getting butthurt over the removal of pop-up camera. I too don't like flaws in th... moreWell actually punch hole and notch both cause a structural integrity issue to displays, giving them a great weakened spot to shatter from.
Hole, this is true, are good against cracks, but only against already formed ones, otherwise they are a structural integrity hasard.
The pop up have nothing to do with the structural integrity of the phone, something like curved edges display do.
And all those are stupid misconception that actually don't reflect AT ALL the reality.
1) Pop up CAN be sealed off of the rest of the phone, that one of the things I constantly explain, you can make an enclosure in the phone which host the pop up, the pop up will have a pair of magnets on each sides, now around that enclosure you put 4 magnets and 4 small magnetic coils, effectively making a magnetic linear actuator, you attract from one side and push from the other the pop up with your electromagnets, pop up who stay in place thanks to 2 of the 4 magnets on the edge, then it will lift/retract and again get secured in place with the magnets, add a couple of springs top and bottom to damped the motion, and the ONLY thing the pop up need is the electric and data connexion, which can pass through in a totally sealed off and waterproof (not just water resistant as IP rating officialise) manner, it will reduce the number of moving part to the pop up only, have virtually no wear except for the guides which keep him straight, it will be really fast and will be TOTALLY sealed off the rest of the phone, oh and also, on top of really low wear and failure potential, it is also cheap as magnets, conductive coil and springs are cheap things.
2) Yes, it can, but SSD still fail, meanwhile there are still floppy disk reader, CD reader, cassette player and even old and 100% mechanical based vinyl reader who still work.
Your display can burn in or simply get fried, which doesn't even talk about that fragile aspect where it is the first piece who get broken on your phone, your SoC and memories (RAM, storage, cache, registers, all of them) wear off with time, which is why dead motherboard, CPU and RAM is a thing on computers, and the battery is THE worst part in there, not only it wear off at each recharge, but also it even got damage even sitting in a powered off phone.
Meanwhile there is almost no report of pop up broken, same for vibration motor or optical stabilisation or zoom.
Yes, it wear off and will eventually break down, but is it really important as the rest of the phone will be long dead ?
3) This is funny because even slamming your pop up lifted phone on the ground still have more chances to cause the display to shatter than the pop up to break, actually because of how it work, there is no direct physical latching mechanism, meaning except spinning the motor, it doesn't do anything when forcefully retracted, except dampening the impact, that's right, not only the pop up is quite tough, but if your phone fall on it, it may actually be the thing that save more fragile components like the display.
Pop up aren't the perfect solution only because most peoples constantly, as you just did, say totally false things about it, causing its popularity to shrink by scarring peoples off of it, otherwise way better and improved, near perfect solution would have already been implemented, as my magnetic linear actuator one, which would also have the advantage of reducing considerably the size of the mechanism since the coil can actually be 0.1mm thin.
Punch hole and teardrop notch on the other hand both have HUGE flaw, they are responsible for the removal of a LOT of USEFUL front sensors, from effective and efficient proximity and ambiant light sensor, big enough front camera lenses, front floodlight and more importantly 3D facial recognition sensors, which not only is important for privacy, but also, what most seem to ignore, is that they are also an important thing against phone thief as having a phone you can't do anything with really deter potential thief.
The underdisplay camera tech is funnily enough maybe the WORSE of all the front camera solution, not only it is EXTREMLY EXPENSIVE, and so hard to make that after millions invested and years of developments, not a single production wordy prototype have been done yet, its not me, its Oppo's CEO who say that they aren't good enough yet as you pointed out.
Also, regardless how good the tech goes, you ALWAYS will have a balance to choose from display image degradation and camera picture degradation, either you have perfectly clear pictures but your display have mediocre light and color over that camera, or you have really good display and the camera can't get any acceptable level of quality.
This compromise mean that the camera rely heavily on software correction to fix the stupidness of looking through an opaque surface which is one of the biggest reason why it haven't been done yet.
On top of that, add the issue that no good enough solution for 3D facial recognition to be really worth it can be implemented and front floodlight can't even be thought about otherwise you'll blind the camera by making the inner side of the display reflect off all the light, and you can also add poor ambiant light and proximity capabilities to the mix.
So is a tech that cost a lot, will get imperfection in both display and pictures, don't allow for any useful sensors and have potentially lot of other drawback really superior to one which could be cheap, reliable, durable and tough, whose lifespan can dramatically surpass the rest of the phone, don't have any picture or display side effect, can when done properly allow for adding additional sensors, is lightning fast, and have for only real drawback the fear of something that is in theory a possibility but actually highly unlikely in reality ?
On the bezel I actually agree, and I often quote the Meizu 16 as a great exemple of possible thin top bezel who actually doesn't affect negatively the display at all, it is already close enough from fullscreen.
But there is two problems, the first one, is that unlike pop up, it doesn't have anything to cover privacy issue, and the second, believe it or not, is caused by teardrop notch and punch hole, yes, even if it doesn't have.
Look at any pre-notch smartphone, their bezel had multiples sensors, but here, heavily influenced by the teardrop notch and punch hole, we find that this phone, with a border to border bezel and way more than enough space for additional sensors, only have a SINGLE thing other than the speaker, which by the way is stupid thin for the available space, only a camera, no additional sensors, even a cheap 10$ 3D facial unlock, no real ambiant light and proximity sensor, no floodlight, no hand gesture, nothing else than just a camera, which is a total waste of space.
And that's why both punch hole and notch are really bad, because of this really bad influence they had on smartphones to now have the trend of only having a single camera because they couldn't use much more space, which even on phones with more than enough space is now also a thing.
Davidoff, 27 Mar 2020The majority of us don't want moving parts. Puncholes are much better. Im not talking about th... moreWell, sorry to break that to you but the MAJORITY of customers don't care, and for those who care, they prefer bezel over other solutions, then the pop up come second.
And that's something anyone can easily verify by looking at various online polls.
But the issue is, "the majority of you" don't even have a good argument against pop up, because it is moving part doesn't mean it will wear out or break before the rest of the phone, your display, your SoC and memory and your battery all are more fragile and wear out faster than the pop up.
And many peoples get scared of the pop up for NO REASONS other than peoples like you saying totally wrong theoretical potential issues that in fact, almost never occur, and despite that, more peoples still prefer pop up over punch hole or notch.
Because if there is a FACT about pop up durability, is it clearly that the number of report on any kind of failure is actually really low, so low that it is challenging to find just few of them.
You want practicality ? Choose the bezel, it is the best solution, you want fullscreen and/or privacy, choose the pop up camera.
Punch hole ONLY add, or actually remove of already limited the number of notification and statut icons you can have, and since there isn't any norm on where it is placed, as it goes from left, center, right from a round hole to a long one, it is hell of a compatibility issue with apps which run in fullscreen.