goron goron, 01 Jun 2010cmon tom how can u'll be so sure bout X10 will got android 3? my P910 M600i never got any upda... moreHow i know XPERIA X10 will get Android 3.0?.
Well lifetime support is lifetime support no matter how you want that to be.
I have been promised alot of stuffs from Sony Ericsson in all of those years i have used their products.
And guess what, then have ALWAYS given me the things they have promised.
Now, how can you prove that to be wrong?.
When they have given me all of the promises to now, then they will still be giving me the things they always promise. I believe them now after so many years. And it would be a disaster for them to lie about something they promise.
Simply because alot of customers would be really pissed off about that then. And that's not doing business. That's losing cutomers and money in the long run.
Ofc, Sony Ericsson needs more money when they make new phones and that, but we have already payed so much for our XPERIA X10 that the lifetime support is worth it on the XPERIA X10.
And no, as long i can run everything smooth and very fast in 2-3 years, then the phone is not outdated that way.
Nokia N8 is already outdated before it's released since it most likely can't run Symbian ^4 lol.
How fail is that?.
In 2 years, then Symbian ^3 is long gone and forgotten and no one will make any programs for it. And while i can run a new and updated OS in 2 years where every developers are supporting the new OS, so i'll get all of the nice applications and that kind of stuffs then on my XPERIA X10.
This is what i'm trying to tell. Nokia N8 have already lost and been outdated the day Symbian ^4 is released.
Ofc Nokia N8 will runs nice and smooth today, but that doesn't help much for the future.
It's best to try it before you buy it, not just fiddling around for a few minutes, but play it untill you can see its normal performance.
Aseem, 01 Jun 2010Firstly live in present. don't live in future. let first x10 get android 2.1 nd then speak abt... moreFirst i will say learn to speak English.
And no your wrong. The XPERIA X10 is capable of doing quite alot of things as long the OS can deliver all of that kind of stuffs to the XPERIA X10.
And no, i rather have an old crappy OS that can be upgraded later on the X10 instead of having hardware that is so old on the N8 that it can't even run the next OS that is being released by Symbian at the end of this year lol.
And i have to lol at you for the statement you gave about the 1 GHz Snapdragon CPU there.
That made my day.
And hani, if someone needs that kind of stuffs, it's you. Because when you see what kind of replies that comes from you here. Then yeah.
Don't speak to high when your as bad as it can get your self.
And if you call that for a good reply back, then hahahahahaha.
And to you Tom. I'm 26 years old and i have been working with computers and all kinds of electronics since i have been 17-18 years old.
Ok, to your questions.
1. Yes the GPU is fast on the Nokia N8, but that doesn't mean the games that comes out in the future will be as good as that because of the crappy CPU.
You know, games gets developed further and games comes with better graphics and higher CPU requirements, like games do on computers. And when the CPU can't compete anylonger, it's over and out.
Nokia N8 is a good camera phone and a good gaming phone, get that?, and that's all about the phone.
Now try to run a CPU benchmark program on the different phones and you will see what i'm trying to explain here.
2. I know the XPERIA X1 isn't fast, but still it's running Android 2.1 pretty damn fast. Doesn't that tells you anything about how little CPU power Android needs to run good?.
I know pretty good that the XPERI X10 beats the Nokia N8 extremely hard in CPU power and on how fast the phone is.
By looking on the YouTube videos of the Nokia N8 now, i can alone by that see that my XPERIA X10 is 2-3 times faster than the Nokia N8.
You better hope the final version of the N8 gets way faster than it have been showing on those YouTube videos so far.
And no, sorry, an old CPU like the Nokia N8 have can't come close to how fast the Snapdragon CPU is, it's not even close by a mile.
Even if the OS in the Nokia N8 might run as fast as my XPERIA X10 with Android 1.6, it doesn't mean everything else in the phone will run that fast.
And there is also another thing you don't get. Even if Nokia N8 would be faster than my XPERIA X10, it will be for nothing when the N8 will be outdated and old in 1 year because it can't run on the next Symbian, while i can run all of the Android releases for the next 2-3 years and maybe more.
So what would you choose, a phone that runs fast now, but have so poor hardware that it can't even run the next version of Symbian, or a phone that have a future proof CPU and other hardware so it can run the next OS'es for the next 2-4 years very good?.
I think the answer here is pretty easy.
Simply, i don't care on how much gaming performance or how fast the Nokia N8 is now today when it can't even run the next Symbian OS that will come out at the end of this year as the rumours says.
Do you know what happens when it's like that?, Nokia will abandon the phone and just give it bug / error fixes some few times here and there. While we who have a phone like XPERIA X10, will get fully support on our phones and will get the newest OS'es that gets released for the next 2-4 years.
When i'm paying 530 euro for a phone, i will enjoy it longer than 1 year.
And when it's about me, i'm very carefully with my phones, so my phones usually lasts for 5-6 years.
See now why a Nokia N8 is a very very bad choice for phone users like me?.
[deleted post]cmon tom how can u'll be so sure bout X10 will got android 3? my P910 M600i never got any update till 2years?? dont fool anyone pls.
all the things u've been said here only base on ur asumption.most of SE fans know that SE support on their phone is not as gud as ur boast.thats why SE almost nail down last 2 years.try to survive on mobile phone battle.
there are no way that u can judge N8 speed before u try it.dont base ur judgement base on ur asumption.
u never even touch N8 or sym 3 so u dont know anything bout it too.just wait for GSMarena review bout the phone than it is fair to judge the speed.
N8 ROM is 512 so i think it is big enough to flash it with future software.
it have GPU too so UI is not a prob
CPU is fast enough for modern phone,like i said it before 5800xm can survive it with only 434 cpu clock and without GPU.
the future of a mobile phone is bout 2 or 3 years and the next 2 or 3 years ur X10 will be outdated too.every month mobile company always lauch a new phone with greater specs so after 2 or 3 years ur X10 will be underpowered by new X bla bla bla series from SE too.
basicly it is useless too buy a phone and planning that ur phone will among the best forever.there will be a new king every year always.and X10 is never going to be a king.
and dont forget it is a phone not religion or cult so buy it whatever u need and dont listen too someone who try to make u regret what u have been purcase.
if u buy X10 u will have the android,no radio,no GPS software,u have to port ur ext memory for apps intallation,and dont forget it will cancelled ur warrant and it might brick ur phone too.
if u buy N8 u will have usb otg,ovi map,gud multitask,hdmi port,dolby,radio.
dont worry bout speed mhz doesnt tell anything bout UI speed,just trust the mobile review or ask someone who already try it or u can try it ur self before u buy it.
Mark, 01 Jun 2010Virtually impossible to do. There is really no point.Hey Mark, you handled that SE paid sick a very well. Hope he close his shop soon. Tom, are you listening? I have something to say; don't force your opinions too badly that everyone start hating you. People are wise enough to choose their device.
Ali Abdulla, 01 Jun 2010wat about Meego, processor + Gpu, should be compatible :(Slightly easier, still virtually impossible. At best S^4. Please remember though, S^3 will make you very happy.
Tom-Helge, 01 Jun 2010It doesn't do that, sorry, the GPU is there to make sure things goes much much smoother, that'... moreThis is a serious question, how old are you, and what background do you have in this technology?
You really have no idea what you are talking about my friend. Ill leave the lecturing, because you are a terrible pupil, but I will leave you with a simple proposition for you to think about.
1 - If the N8 with lower CPU specs has much higher benchmarks than an also symbian sporting 8910, how is this possible? ? The 8910 has a much newer and faster CPU... check this link:
The line in red is the most important one. You can actually see how the CPU in the 8910 is stronger, but that does not translate into higher fps for the interface, or better acceleration AT ALL.
Or read the mobile-review forum for more in depth analysis.
The answer to the above question is GPU & Hardware Acceleration. It is the most demanding task in a phone. By far. Which is why 20 dollar phones can make phones calls just as well. It is all about the graphics, whether it is OS effects, 3D games, you name it. Every nice thing about Android, movement, fluidity, is all GPU stuff that now needs to be handled by the CPU.
2 - You cannot possible know if the X1 or X10 is faster than the N8 because we have no suitable cross platform benchmark we can employ, and judging from the X10 I played with, I highly doubt it. Anyway, untill we can run lets say, need for speed shift, optimized for both devices, against each other and compare frame rates, we will not know for sure. We can use other tests as well, decoding, moving in storage, video output, but now, it is impossible to tell. The fact that you think you can state the X10 is faster is hilarious and makes you a fanboy. And a poor one at that sorry to say.
CPU in itself does not say anything about speed of operation. The reason why your phone will be faster if it ever gets 2.2 is the same reason why this N8 might well be snappier than your X10.
You seem to be stuck in a old fashioned mode, and have no idea of what ceteris paribus means in testing.
You are talking out of your ass sir. You really are.
Now, give me numbers to disprove the points above, give me links to solid research that contradicts me or show me benchmarks of the things you state and as it related to the N8. If not, eat humble pie.
Rajesh, 01 Jun 2010If you are from Indo you must have followed the trend of the mobile operators at the moment...... moreind? internet speed from 3G gsm provider in there is suck.u pay for 3G u've got only gprs speed,the promotion was great 3'5mb,but in real u've only got 30-60kbps.so no streaming on busway never dream bout it.4G? the LTE plans were held by the gov they said that the 3G were enough for people.grazy policy.thats why the country never grown.there are no cheap internet mobile,yes there r cable internet but its not cheap,and not speedy.dont forget crime rate.people buying phone only for trends like BB they never really using the push email instead only for call and sms and some FB.
Mark, 01 Jun 2010Virtually impossible to do. There is really no point.wat about Meego, processor + Gpu, should be compatible :(
I have a question for all the super tech out there.
Can I erase the current OS on this phone and replace it with Windown Mobile 6.5?
Any advise on this would be greatly appreciated.
[deleted post]Firstly live in present. don't live in future. let first x10 get android 2.1 nd then speak abt 2.2, even sony dosen't knw when in q4 they gonna give 2.1 to x10. Nw live with ur x10 which crappy old-age android 1.6. Even with 1 ghz processor it lacks all the features. Even if u put all the latest technology of n8 into x10 it's 1ghz procesoor won't be able to handle it.
Mark, 01 Jun 2010Tom,
A GPU does not make an Android device faster, since it is not HW accelerated. It does ... moreIt doesn't do that, sorry, the GPU is there to make sure things goes much much smoother, that's why you can run things via the GPU.
If the GPU controlls the speed of your device, that what the hell is the point of the CPU then?.
My XPERIA X10 can't run things via the GPU yet, and because of that, things wont go as smooth as other OS'es that runs things via the GPU, but one thing is sure, when it's about speed, the XPERIA X10 pwns the crap out of the Nokia N8 when it's about speed.
The speed you see from XPERIA X10 now while it have Android 1.6 is very slow, but still it's twice as fast as Nokia N8.
So how do you explain that?.
Tom-Helge, 01 Jun 2010First i will say that the reason why XPERIA X10 doesn't get any good benchmarks now is because... moreTom,
A GPU does not make an Android device faster, since it is not HW accelerated. It does for S^3 devices, GET THIS IN YOUR HEAD.
It is not the same. Android on the N8 specs would be terrible. It does not use that GPU. The GPU, or lack of GPU support in the UI layer of Android is the MAIN reason why it is still laggy at times.
Come on man, it is the 10th time I explain to you now. You are comparing scooters and trucks and then saying a bigger engine in the truck, so it must be faster....
Rajesh, 01 Jun 2010Mark, your knowledge revolves only around processor and thats it...you are not coming up with ... moreHi Rajesh,
Thanks for your post, much better than the swearing I saw last time.
Why I speak about the processor, is because it is the "2009" spec you are referring to. I know the ARM 11 in N8 would perform very poorly in an Android device. I also know A8 is faster, and A9 will be faster again. That is not the point, the point is, it is all about user experience.
The user experience is defined by how responsive the UI is. As opposed to Android ( which I like) S^3 uses extensive hw acceleration for the UI. The CPU in the N8 has very little to do compared to the CPU in an Android device. I think that shows the strength of the software, and not the inability of Nokia to produce something better specced. It is a good choice I think, it saves battery life. That is a big problem in Android devices now, exactly for this reason.
Also, please not that the GPU (which is really very important in this HW / SW set up) is actually very strong, and has been maxing out benchmarks consistently.
The N8 has a weaker CPU, a strong GPU and an OS that is perfect for such a set up. Why on earth would this be bad then? Surely, maxing out GL benchmarks is not 2009? Surely, being significantly faster than an A8 running 8910 is not being 2009? It is actually fundamental software progress.
I think we will see better specced phones come still from Nokia. MeeGo device will run the ST Ericssion U8500 chip, allowing 1080 p 3d gaming.
Nokia knows hardware like no other company, they just chose to use these parts for this mid range device, because it makes perfect sense.
Unless, of course, they enter it in a CPU mhz competition. But you know, consumers do not do that. They care about responsiveness.
I wont respond to your response until tomorrow, off to a party now.
Mark, 01 Jun 2010Really, Tom, first I was amazed, now you just crack me up, spending entire days writing subjec... moreFirst i will say that the reason why XPERIA X10 doesn't get any good benchmarks now is because of Android 1.6.
Ask me the same question when it have Android 2.2.
And the thing that Nokia N8 will outsell XPERIA X10, well lets see. How many more devices of XPERIA X10 do you think Sony Ericsson will sell before Nokia N8 is out?.
But again, you can't decide how good a device is by looking at how many units that have been sold. Because you know, iPhone sells quite alot, while being the crappiest smart phone in the world now.
So that point is moot and not valid at all.
All i hear from you guys is that oooooh ooooooh the GPU is everything in the Nokia N8. Again, a damn GPU can't controll how fast your device is. GET THAT INTO YOUR HEADS.
This is like saying that yeah, my computer have an old AMD Athlon X2 4600+ CPU, but it have a Radeon 5870 GPU.
That means the GPU can run the games like Crysis Warhead and the games that comes out in the future, but can the CPU run the games like Crysis Warhead and so on without stutterling like crazy?.
The development of the mobile OS'es and mobile phones are going fast forward now, and it will be the same with both apps and games on mobile phones. So things will get much much faster and will require butt load more out of your device.
If you don't get this into your head, you simply don't know much about technology and mobile phones. End of story.
Then to you yourself. You say to me that i can't read or respond?. Oh so your saying all of those i'm discussing with here can reply and respond any better?.
I can tell you that all i see and hear from them are just whining and crying because i have proven them wrong in most things. And then can't do anything to prove me wrong.
I'm still waiting for the facts against my facts.
Mark, 01 Jun 2010Really, Tom, first I was amazed, now you just crack me up, spending entire days writing subjec... moreMark, your knowledge revolves only around processor and thats it...you are not coming up with something new...you have a look what GSM arena has posted about Qualcomm processors and what is going to be the fate of present ones is a anybodys judjement. The fact is N8 is going to have a terribly short life and will shred its value in terms of pricing very very fast. Even faster than the proccessor speed it carries. By the end of the year people will be expecting S4 with new line up of processors in Mobiles of all major companies including Nokia. whatever you have to say about traingles, GPU etc etc will not be even looked at by the end of 2010.
Like in case of E72, Nokia delayed its launch by atleast 4 months...what happend to it...though its a Qwerty device with fastest processor it lost its 40% commercial value in just 3 months.
You may praise the hardware of N8 but the point is it wont be the best option when Nokia will launch it unless Nokia goes ahead and launch it next week. By the end of 3rd Quarter of 2010 you will see loads of new models on the net and mind you Nokia, Sony Ericsson, Samsung and every company is working on it. And above all 4G will be the added advantage...
You keep speaking about processor it wont lead you anywhere...you will stay where you are and N8 will stay where it is supposed to stay...You cant change the pace of technological advancement...its is furiously speeding its way with time...today will be history in few months and new technology will be the story in months to come...
Thats why I said N8 is 2009 device....
Tom-Helge, 01 Jun 2010I know what i'm talking about. With a CPU from stoneage with 680 MHz and with a poor RAM that ... moreReally, Tom, first I was amazed, now you just crack me up, spending entire days writing subjective dribble here. Honest question here, does your Android sporting X10 max out any benchmarks lately? I appreciate your energy, but it seems this is a paid job, and what worse, you deliberately choose not to understand technology. There you go again with your "big programs" etc, and NO GPU in your reasoning anywhere. You DO know the one in your phone is relatively poor no? And you DO know that better games will require this. A more efficient Dalvik is not going to change that, because it does not matter. Why do you insist on stating the obvious (lower spec CPU) while ignoring the much more interesting and important GPU. After all both games and the gui are hw accelerated. It is incredibly important. Why do you leave such things out of your reasoning?
I can tell you one thing, whatever it is you say about the N8, or even your precious X10, the NOKIA N8 will outsell the X10 by a factor of 5 tot 10, at least. Let the consumer decide on its merits, as we are obviously not fit to have a grown up discussion here. The consumers have already decided on what they think of Sony, Ericsson and SE in the past. (I happily used one of those tiny Ericsson T28 (?) in the past)